Date: Tue Oct 07 19:19:23 1997
To: Frank Grose
From: Rob Weinberg
Subject: Re: Let's change the subject line....
At 05:22 PM 10/7/97, you wrote:
I keep looking for that COMMON foundation, but we seem to be diverging. Any ideas?
Well, in part it depends on who you're talking to. Rob, the guy with opinions on lots of subjects who happens to be Jewish, or Rob, the representative of all Jews. In the latter category, I'm not really worth talking to.
I've tried to define God as I understand Him. I thought somewhere in there we would find agreement. Help me out here.
Well, I know that when I think of God, that it's probably not the same as you think of. And if you remind yourself of that, so we don't make assumptions, we'll be all right. I don't, for myself, have a set definable concept. For myself I think it arrogant to presume I know what he is, because my frame of reference, being human, is so limited. I do not trust in man to tell me, and I do not trust the Bible (NT and OT) to be THE WORD for reasons I've shared before. I do believe we have much to learn from the Bible, and that we should strive to govern our behavior on earth according to what lessons we can derive from it and other sources of "divine inspiration." Finally, I believe that, as you know, there are many paths to the same end, that there is not necessarily ONE WAY, but that the journey is, itself, what is important.
Our nation had lost some of its Christian "character" by the late 1800's, and even more in modern times. BTW, did you know the Pilgrims were actually living in Holland before setting out for the New World? I'll find you a quote on "Christian principles" when I get home tonight.
I had an interesting discussion with someone today who had in his youth minored in church history. He rattled off all sorts of interesting things. He's a Baptist. It made me want to get some books on the history of the various churches in America. I'm presuming you're Baptist, apologies if not. But did you know that Jefferson's famous "wall of separation" letter to the Danbury Baptists was written to ASSURE them that government wouldn't intrude, that historically until recently, Baptists were in the minority, that until recently Baptists were major participants in the forerunner of what has now become Americans for Separation of Church and State? I think it'd be very interesting to compare what the Baptist leadership of today says to that of 50 yrs. ago. I think what we'd find is that since they've become "the majority" they've forgotten the lessons of what if felt like to be in the minority.
Agreed. I've been lead to believe that our founders drew a great distinction between "democracy" and "republic." That difference seems to have been lost in today's world (or perhaps willfully ignored).
As I understand the terms, our founding fathers didn't really believe in "democracy" except at the local level. They didn't trust to the common man especially to make decisions that would affect them as major property holders. The real last bastion of true democracy, IMHO, is at the local school board level. I really think you need to join up with the Republican party and work on convincing them to put you up as a candidate for county commission.
Sadly, I don't think man nor society changes very much very fast.
If at all, judging by history.
Education helps, however.
Amen.
I guess what I was trying to say is that charges of anti-Semitism, racism, and sexual harassment are determined, in some cases, by those making the charge. (This is one of my soap boxes, but I'll try to spare you the long version.)
Litigating such issues as I do from the defense perspective, I'm very well aware of what you're saying and agree. My feeling is that the litigation mentality only perpetuates such problems, so I'm always looking for another way, although usually by the time I'm involved, there's a lawsuit pending. Still, we have to find a different way.
You really don't seem to understand where I'm coming from on this.
True, so we just back up and try and different approach. ; )
I'm not sure I'm up to the task of explaining it. But, God seemed to deal more closely with the Jews more before the first century AD. I'm only relying on biblical history.
Clearly the Bible had a profound impact on western civilization. There were other civilizations though. And who else is the Bible going to deal with than the Jews before the first century? That's who wrote it.
Whether I learn the Bible or not, a question we can pose to ourselves is whether there is any way to reconcile my "multiple paths" idea with your ONE WAY beliefs so that everyone is happy.
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